Red Death
11-01-2006, 09:41 AM
#131
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Re: Red Death
where is every body?? Mark and I had have the Ocean to our self.... Saturday we run with a Cig name "Franchesca" That is the only boat we seen. who wants to coma out and play! 
11-01-2006, 10:03 AM
#132
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Re: Red Death
Originally Posted by lucy
where is every body?? Mark and I had have the Ocean to our self.... Saturday we run with a Cig name "Franchesca" That is the only boat we seen. who wants to coma out and play!
My guess it has something to do with $3 fuel and 5-figure insurance bills.
11-01-2006, 02:10 PM
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Re: Red Death
Originally Posted by cougarman
Chris,
What 46' Cougar did you have?
Do you have any photo's of it? And what did ya have in it for power?
I see ya like your Apache, and I'm not debating that LOL.
But curious to what you thought of the 46' Cougar and what you really liked about it?
I'm hoping to be near or at completion on my 46' Cougar next fall.
Been a trailer Queen since I've owned it. 
Thanks
Cougarman
What 46' Cougar did you have?
Do you have any photo's of it? And what did ya have in it for power?
I see ya like your Apache, and I'm not debating that LOL.
But curious to what you thought of the 46' Cougar and what you really liked about it?
I'm hoping to be near or at completion on my 46' Cougar next fall.
Been a trailer Queen since I've owned it. Thanks
Cougarman
edit:He´s located in the Archipelago of Stockholm Sweden.
Last edited by Luuk; 11-01-2006 at 02:22 PM.
11-01-2006, 02:29 PM
#134
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Re: Red Death
Originally Posted by Chris Sunkin
Had an all-white glass 46- bought it out of northern MI. Had OMC's on it- no motors. Put 3 540's with #3's in it. All my pics are film (was late going digital).
Don't get me wrong, the Cougar was a wave crusher. It was just really heavy and always felt stuck in the water. I was going to strip the cabin to see what that would do but I came across another 41 and decided to "go back home". I think my X was too conservative and that probably didn't help matters much. It would have been a major job to get it where I wanted it. The other issue I had was storage. Racks for boats that size don't exist around here. That's alot of trailer boat.
The Apache gives me the best of both worlds- wave crushing but it also feels "nimble" for lack of a better description. I guess nimble might not be the best word for it- especially for a resin bucket. The Apache just feels like it's running out of the water but still well-connected. The feel is always there- it gives you a sense of security even running hard. There's a video that was posted not long ago that shows what I mean. I think it was the Team boat- running on about the last 8' of the keel but flawlessly running straight and connected.
I'll have to admit- Every time I see one of those tin Cougar 46's on the market, I'm really tempted.
If I were you, I'd get with someone who has had some serious hands-on with the boats. They could give you better tuning suggestions. I'd definitely toss the cabin and lighten it as best you can. 5-blades might help- that was suggested to me. I don't know if anyone makes them for 3's or not- I never got that far.
What all are you doing to your 46?
Don't get me wrong, the Cougar was a wave crusher. It was just really heavy and always felt stuck in the water. I was going to strip the cabin to see what that would do but I came across another 41 and decided to "go back home". I think my X was too conservative and that probably didn't help matters much. It would have been a major job to get it where I wanted it. The other issue I had was storage. Racks for boats that size don't exist around here. That's alot of trailer boat.
The Apache gives me the best of both worlds- wave crushing but it also feels "nimble" for lack of a better description. I guess nimble might not be the best word for it- especially for a resin bucket. The Apache just feels like it's running out of the water but still well-connected. The feel is always there- it gives you a sense of security even running hard. There's a video that was posted not long ago that shows what I mean. I think it was the Team boat- running on about the last 8' of the keel but flawlessly running straight and connected.
I'll have to admit- Every time I see one of those tin Cougar 46's on the market, I'm really tempted.
If I were you, I'd get with someone who has had some serious hands-on with the boats. They could give you better tuning suggestions. I'd definitely toss the cabin and lighten it as best you can. 5-blades might help- that was suggested to me. I don't know if anyone makes them for 3's or not- I never got that far.
What all are you doing to your 46?
MRD maintained the boat from day 1 until I bought it.
I guess it was a pig to start with and took forever to get on plane.
#4,..........#3,..........#4
Level.........2" low.....Level......with bottom
Then switched to:
#4,..........#4,..........#4
2"low........2"high......2"low......with bottom
and picked up 5 to 6 mph, went on plane easier and all throttled the same after that.
They also said same thing that it seemed stuck to the water until ya got it over 70 mph then it finally came alive and felt like 30' once everything broke loose and started running like hell.
Here's a quote from the original owner in an email.
( THERE IS A NUMBER OF FACTORS TO WHAT WILL MAKE THE BOAT RUN REAL WELL IN THOSE HIGH SPEED NUMBERS… NO QUESTION HORSE POWER, I WOULD SAY THE MOTORS WERE IN THE 1150-1200 RANGE.
MOST IMPORTANT WAS THE HIGH TORQUE, THIS IS WHAT GETS THE BOAT UP AND GOING AND KEEPS IT RUNNING.
THE TORQUE NUMBERS WERE VERY HIGH AND THEY STAYED STEADY THROUGH VERY A LONG PART OF THE CURVE, UNFORTUNATELY I DO NOT HAVE THE DYNO SHEETS BUT I WILL TELL YOU THAT TORQUE IS A BIG FACTOR.
WE KNOW THE BOAT RAN IN THAT 117 PLUS RANGE AS A NUMBER OF TIMES WE WERE UP AGAINST A COUPLE OF CATS AND THEY COULDN’T BELIEVE I WAS ALONG SIDE OF THEM WHILE THEY WERE POUNDING AND HOLDING ON FOR DEAR LIFE!
I HOPE I HAVE GIVEN YOU SOME DIRECTION HERE AND AGAIN PLEASE FEEL FREE TO SHARE ANY OTHER THOUGHTS OR QUESTIONS WITH ME. )
He took great care of the boat and maintained it with an open check book. Since I bought it he has moved into a 46' skater.
Anyways back to your question I bought just the hull and have gathered up all the hard ware to but it back together.
Tall Deck 588's with #6's. Hoping she'll run good for what it is.
Cougarman
11-01-2006, 03:40 PM
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Re: Red Death
Everything for sale has a market price .Once again (and may i say NO ONE has answered my question)if they arw worth what you guys are CLAIMING ,why are the SAME boats for sale on the sales forem ,month after month.Because you own them naturally you think they are worth more then they are. Be realistic asking ang getting are very different. Everything sold (cars ,real estate ect) is based on comp values.Please nane the last Apache approx 20 years old that sold above 200,000.00
11-01-2006, 03:52 PM
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Re: Red Death
PS My friend Steve Leiffs 41 (Apache Warrior )is in excellent condition ,with a semi included and as i stated he can not get 85000.00 The boat is a short stagger (very heavy ) radar arcy,800,number 3as It needs very little cosmetically and as one guy referred is not some beat up piece of garbage. It is a two owner boat never raced and maintained with an open checkbook.The market is just not there for the NUMBERS some biased owners are claiming.
11-01-2006, 05:02 PM
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Re: Red Death
Originally Posted by REDDEATH
PS My friend Steve Leiffs 41 (Apache Warrior )is in excellent condition ,with a semi included and as i stated he can not get 85000.00 The boat is a short stagger (very heavy ) radar arcy,800,number 3as It needs very little cosmetically and as one guy referred is not some beat up piece of garbage. It is a two owner boat never raced and maintained with an open checkbook.The market is just not there for the NUMBERS some biased owners are claiming.
11-01-2006, 05:39 PM
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Re: Red Death
Carl,how much more is Tonto worth twice.Please answer my last two questions.Please name the last 20 year old Apache that sold for more than 200,000.00 Please explain to me WHY we see the same boats for sale on the sales forem month after month.Awhile ago i had dinner with a friend who owns a large marine here in NJ.This guy has has or sold nearly every brand of high performance boat out there.He loves the Apaches .But has told me more than once (because of my expressed sales interest)no matter the condition,equiptment (engines drives )layup ect if you spend OVER 175-200 GRAND on one of them you will NEVER ,EVER get your money back.The market is dictated buy the year on the hull more than anything and twenty years is twenty years.
11-01-2006, 06:02 PM
#140
Re: Red Death
Originally Posted by Chris Sunkin
No doubt that the quality is there. Both Mark and Bobby built tremendously well-made boats. I'm talking more from a design perspective- I don't care for the new deck design Mark is using and as far as Chief building any successor to Apache, I think the step-bottom puts that argument to rest.
You like that old school Apache powerboat look. Can't say as I blame you.
Ed
