Diesel engines in speed boat
10-14-2008, 11:09 PM
#341
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True Cummins doesn't have a decent 14L class engine. But Cat C-15 ACERT engines are a nice package and have an E rating of 865 hp. Also Komatsu's 6M140 with an A5 rating of 930 hp ain't no slouch either. Also I hear Komatsu is gonna up that when they come out with a higher number when they come out with the new common rail model.
Look at Buzzi's 42' Patrol RIB with twin C-15 ACERTS. It does 70 knots out of the box. Wonder what it would do with a few tweaks
Look at Buzzi's 42' Patrol RIB with twin C-15 ACERTS. It does 70 knots out of the box. Wonder what it would do with a few tweaks
10-15-2008, 05:55 AM
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joe,
Absolutely agree. I am happy at 50mph too
Hey when your beautiful wife AND your five kids AND their friends want to go someplace on the water over 15 miles away for the evening..this is the boat.
This thread is a terrific resource for those that will be powering a faster boat w diesels. I love the fact that the thread has legs and helped me make decisions way after it should have been buried in the forum. The weight and numbers hopefully give a real world baseline to those looking at diesels in a more standard hull with fixed surface drives. Go diesel. I will work with you to do that 45 footer with the cummins by the way...that sounds fun.
Absolutely agree. I am happy at 50mph too
Hey when your beautiful wife AND your five kids AND their friends want to go someplace on the water over 15 miles away for the evening..this is the boat. This thread is a terrific resource for those that will be powering a faster boat w diesels. I love the fact that the thread has legs and helped me make decisions way after it should have been buried in the forum. The weight and numbers hopefully give a real world baseline to those looking at diesels in a more standard hull with fixed surface drives. Go diesel. I will work with you to do that 45 footer with the cummins by the way...that sounds fun.
10-15-2008, 06:37 AM
#343
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Jassman,
It's very easy and again no Bullsh*t it was done 20 years ago with mechanical engines. It boils down to loosing midrange unless you have a 2 speed.
600 hp Cummins C's will put you close.
715 QSM 11's and your smokin' in a 43'.
Jass, I wrote about this on here once before and some people laughed at me for being a dinousaur. Get the Arenson drives with the chain boxes on them so the drives can be lowered in the boat and put close together. (People don't realize when looking at the Buzzi boats how close and low the drives were. Our OD boxes were made on an offset and angled in and down to connect to the drives).
You can get your OD (.70 depending on which engine) gearing through the chain boxes and when you use a 2 speed you want a final drive of 1:1. I beleive the ZF has a 1.33:1 / 1:1 that gives you direct drive to get on plane and hit high gear and you have OD.
Your going to loose mid-range speed because of the smaller dia props you'll be using. So the ability to plane at probalbly less than 30-40 mph will not exist, the boat either plows along or is up and humming.
You can take this to any builder and they most likely will say "NO way". But they haven't build fast diesel boats, raced diesel boats or lost $4 million of their own money playing with them.
I say these things with conviction because they work, if you wanted to I'd fly down and meet you and discuss in person. I want nothing from you, I'd spend my money to help you get going because I would like someone with some b*lls to get off their azz and do what I can't afford to do anymore.
Joe Gere
I'm really starting to sound crazy aren't I ????
It's very easy and again no Bullsh*t it was done 20 years ago with mechanical engines. It boils down to loosing midrange unless you have a 2 speed.
600 hp Cummins C's will put you close.
715 QSM 11's and your smokin' in a 43'.
Jass, I wrote about this on here once before and some people laughed at me for being a dinousaur. Get the Arenson drives with the chain boxes on them so the drives can be lowered in the boat and put close together. (People don't realize when looking at the Buzzi boats how close and low the drives were. Our OD boxes were made on an offset and angled in and down to connect to the drives).
You can get your OD (.70 depending on which engine) gearing through the chain boxes and when you use a 2 speed you want a final drive of 1:1. I beleive the ZF has a 1.33:1 / 1:1 that gives you direct drive to get on plane and hit high gear and you have OD.
Your going to loose mid-range speed because of the smaller dia props you'll be using. So the ability to plane at probalbly less than 30-40 mph will not exist, the boat either plows along or is up and humming.
You can take this to any builder and they most likely will say "NO way". But they haven't build fast diesel boats, raced diesel boats or lost $4 million of their own money playing with them.
I say these things with conviction because they work, if you wanted to I'd fly down and meet you and discuss in person. I want nothing from you, I'd spend my money to help you get going because I would like someone with some b*lls to get off their azz and do what I can't afford to do anymore.
Joe Gere
I'm really starting to sound crazy aren't I ????
motors are too heavy..Like I said, I had the 485hp Yanmars and you can only get two in a 43 NorTech or any same size boat. Anything more than 1800 pounds per drivetrain rigged will not work, or should I say achieve speeds higher than 80mph. We just got under 75 in our testing. The multi speed trannies Im all for.
10-15-2008, 03:45 PM
#344
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Jassman,
Maybe the boat is that weight sensitive but I don't think so?
You take our #46 the Gancia, 4 x 600 hp Seateks @ w/ gears 1,600 lbs each that's 6,400 lbs of engine plus the 2 extra drives and all the extra fuel for 2 more engines. realixe back in the day a class 1 race was 175 miles!!! Full of fuel she could still go right at 95 mph and that was 46' and about 9 1/2 beam, pretty wide boat.
That's why I doubt that extra weight would kill the deal.
I have yet with all the diesel talk on here and RIK who I respect tremendously have yet to hear anyone ever say they even attempted to try what I'm saying works and has worked for many years even to this day for the Europeans.
I wish someone would jump in and say they tried it and it didn't work, then I would have to agree with you and say maybe the Buzzi hulls were just so different?
BUT, I would tell you to call Craig Barrie and ask him how the SH American series ran in 1990 as he and Bud were the only non-SH person to ride in that boat. He felt it accelerated harder than his gas boats did!
So, someone please dispute with hard numbers what I am saying.
Joe Gere
Maybe the boat is that weight sensitive but I don't think so?
You take our #46 the Gancia, 4 x 600 hp Seateks @ w/ gears 1,600 lbs each that's 6,400 lbs of engine plus the 2 extra drives and all the extra fuel for 2 more engines. realixe back in the day a class 1 race was 175 miles!!! Full of fuel she could still go right at 95 mph and that was 46' and about 9 1/2 beam, pretty wide boat.
That's why I doubt that extra weight would kill the deal.
I have yet with all the diesel talk on here and RIK who I respect tremendously have yet to hear anyone ever say they even attempted to try what I'm saying works and has worked for many years even to this day for the Europeans.
I wish someone would jump in and say they tried it and it didn't work, then I would have to agree with you and say maybe the Buzzi hulls were just so different?
BUT, I would tell you to call Craig Barrie and ask him how the SH American series ran in 1990 as he and Bud were the only non-SH person to ride in that boat. He felt it accelerated harder than his gas boats did!
So, someone please dispute with hard numbers what I am saying.
Joe Gere
10-17-2008, 08:24 AM
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Forgot to mention that the two seatek diesels and trannies and fixed surface drives were within a few hundred pounds of the three 454 trs drivetrains so no waterline change...just a tad move forward in the cg.
10-17-2008, 08:38 AM
#350
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