CMI HEADERS 700 BOAT LEAKING NEED lOPTIONS
#31
Registered
[QUOTE=Somethin' Sexy;4030116]Is it just me, or is anyone else tired of the crap prdoucts that Mercury Racing puts out? 1350's,1100's, drive failures, including #6's, for no apparent reason, 525, 600, 700 header issues. The only decent reliable product that they put out was the 496 and 525 (minus the headers), which is why I believe they have discontinued production of these.
How they can cram a motor into an outboard casing and it be more reliable is beyond me. Maybe the fisherman ***** more than we do.
You would think after 50 years, they could get it right.
Although the header was a Mercury spec, I also blame CMI for allowing these to go to production. They had to know the header was inferior. Kinda of like hiring a roofer to plumb my house...[/QUOTE]
Long ago, CMI's made good headers. THey were not the "cool" collar and better alloy. The flange and the tube weld was better also. Then the co. was sold. merc. was thinking about buying the co. but instead they changed the specs. Both CMI's and Merc headers are pretty ****ty as far as leaks and problems the specs don't change much. just a legal loop hole that they don't have to warranty after a year. It's called "planned obsolescence" so you buy new stuff or pay for repairs. CMI can blame you or merc for the failure, Merc will blame CMI or silent choice, tips. etc. but neither one have to and they haven't stepped up to the plate to resolve. They will only admit to things after a bunch of drinks, and I have this from the "horses mouth" from both co. CMI is not owned by the original founder of the Co. (when the headers were ok) it's owned by some furniture mega, profit driven a' hole firm.
CMI or any co. will make and sell what ever a buyer wants. IE Merc. ) then they can say it's not "their fault" and of course Merc can say. "we didn't make then" go after CMI. It's all BS, and we get stuck with the costs.
How they can cram a motor into an outboard casing and it be more reliable is beyond me. Maybe the fisherman ***** more than we do.
You would think after 50 years, they could get it right.
Although the header was a Mercury spec, I also blame CMI for allowing these to go to production. They had to know the header was inferior. Kinda of like hiring a roofer to plumb my house...[/QUOTE]
Long ago, CMI's made good headers. THey were not the "cool" collar and better alloy. The flange and the tube weld was better also. Then the co. was sold. merc. was thinking about buying the co. but instead they changed the specs. Both CMI's and Merc headers are pretty ****ty as far as leaks and problems the specs don't change much. just a legal loop hole that they don't have to warranty after a year. It's called "planned obsolescence" so you buy new stuff or pay for repairs. CMI can blame you or merc for the failure, Merc will blame CMI or silent choice, tips. etc. but neither one have to and they haven't stepped up to the plate to resolve. They will only admit to things after a bunch of drinks, and I have this from the "horses mouth" from both co. CMI is not owned by the original founder of the Co. (when the headers were ok) it's owned by some furniture mega, profit driven a' hole firm.
CMI or any co. will make and sell what ever a buyer wants. IE Merc. ) then they can say it's not "their fault" and of course Merc can say. "we didn't make then" go after CMI. It's all BS, and we get stuck with the costs.
#32
Registered
Platinum Member
Paradox (or anybody else)...
Any view on the Hardin Marine 525/600/700 headers. Are they better? Worse ?? I was originally steered away from them not because of quality but because of possible fit issues and the timetable I was on at the time. Now, I'm possibly looking at three sets of headers for a new boat I'm looking at and I have plenty of time. Are Hardin's a better option ? Anyone ??
Any view on the Hardin Marine 525/600/700 headers. Are they better? Worse ?? I was originally steered away from them not because of quality but because of possible fit issues and the timetable I was on at the time. Now, I'm possibly looking at three sets of headers for a new boat I'm looking at and I have plenty of time. Are Hardin's a better option ? Anyone ??
#33
Registered
Someone can step in here if I'm incorrect but i think the majority of the issues were on staggered engine setups due to the long tails and how much they flexed.
Last edited by neva satisfied; 11-20-2013 at 02:56 PM.
#35
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Reliable and making it to all stops is the plan.
Money is not a problem getting educated and sharing imformation is were I am coming from so I only do this once not two or three times.
Oh! how things going with the your new arrival.
#36
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Take a look at these . http://www.diamondperformanceparts.c...cat=280&page=1
#37
Fast Singles Club
Gold Member
Give their construction a thorough review then shop around for the best price . I have been watching and have heard zero complaints on their quality only about price . On the other hand there are numerous horror stories about CMI and not just with the Merc spec header , I have a few myself and have had a belly full of that company . Here is a set of Hardin Hurricane Lites that a member here had for sale a few months ago .
Last edited by the deep; 11-20-2013 at 04:49 PM.
#38
Registered
[QUOTE=HyFive578;4030038]
It's true that the Gen-X headers have the "cool collar" design where the outer tubes taper about 1/4" before the flange and it's true that older style headers had the outer tubes run all the way to the flange but just because the headers have the cool collar design doesn't mean they are OK.
The headers that failed on me where "newer design" with the cool collars but were from the vintage (2004) where the grade of stainless was inferior and CMI was not heat treating the headers. From what I've been told, it wasn't until 2010 that the headers that CMI made for Merc as OEM were improved.
You can tell a Gen-x header because it looks nothing like a CMI/Merc OEM header. It has separate distribution tubes that attach to the header with small rubber hoses and there is no bypass hose between the distribution tubes and tails. The Gen-x header is better quality overall than the CMI/Merc header.
So the 2010 and newer Mercury headers are holding up better? Sorry for the questions but I just starting following the CMI saga..
Thanks,
It's true that the Gen-X headers have the "cool collar" design where the outer tubes taper about 1/4" before the flange and it's true that older style headers had the outer tubes run all the way to the flange but just because the headers have the cool collar design doesn't mean they are OK.
The headers that failed on me where "newer design" with the cool collars but were from the vintage (2004) where the grade of stainless was inferior and CMI was not heat treating the headers. From what I've been told, it wasn't until 2010 that the headers that CMI made for Merc as OEM were improved.
You can tell a Gen-x header because it looks nothing like a CMI/Merc OEM header. It has separate distribution tubes that attach to the header with small rubber hoses and there is no bypass hose between the distribution tubes and tails. The Gen-x header is better quality overall than the CMI/Merc header.
Thanks,
#39
VIP Member
VIP Member
Perfect Storm
Did you go back with CMI mercury headers or did you get non mercury CMI headers.
A good friend of mine said CMI headers are fine just dont get the ones mercury has CMI build to there specs.
If you put mercury CMI on did you have any trouble after you installed the mercury CMI new headers?
Did you go back with CMI mercury headers or did you get non mercury CMI headers.
A good friend of mine said CMI headers are fine just dont get the ones mercury has CMI build to there specs.
If you put mercury CMI on did you have any trouble after you installed the mercury CMI new headers?
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Last edited by Perfect Storm; 11-20-2013 at 06:31 PM.
#40
Registered
Second, minor issue, when I was talking about this suit on OSO I was suddenly banned from OSO for a short period of time, which I understood why (CMI is an advertiser as is Mercury, and I am just a long-time platinum member, I don't spend as much on OSO as does Mercury and CMI).
I guess I will stay in the criminal defense realm, I felt bad after having spoke with at least 10-20 OSO members who experienced real world trouble and expense due to header failure(s), and I was unable to go forward and fight for them, it is just too much money for a solo lawyer to commence such an action in the right way and not in a half-ass manner, and if cannot do it to the best of my ability with the proper resources then I should mind my own business. I needed metallurgist(s), design engineers, and other expert as to why the header failed: design defect, manufacturing defect (materials - the stainless used, and or weld techniques), and any other applicable experts and data to help in the Plaintiff's suit
To those who I spoke with my apology, you all had a good case (winnable). Keep in mind that Class Action suits are not my forte.
The class action suit for the CMI header failure is just waiting to happen, someone someday will go forward, I hope I don't get banned again for this very topic.
Stephen "Smarty" Jones, Esquire
PS I have always liked the KE Header
Last edited by Smarty; 11-20-2013 at 05:56 PM.