Hydrocruiser

Stingray69 had a question about the whole Goldcap thing and additives that was going around on various formus a month ago. So I pasted it here to try to keep all the oil stuff in one place for one stop shopping.



The market for "extended mileage synthetic oil" was previously a niche' market that belonged to some smaller oil blenders. Mobil showed up with Goldcap Extended and there was a lot of bashing of it in several forums without any substantiation it turns out. Blenders worried their marketshare would be erroded. My best guess is much of the mud slinging was and continues to be from distributors of the other brands hiding under various screennames. I was concerned back then for everybody. I indicted I was "passing on information"...etc.

I obtained a sample analysis of Goldcap and it is of a better TBN (type of base) than Redcap was and it has more boron and ZDDP in it with about the same moly levels as Redcap. So in plain English...test results prove Mobil has a very good new product and much information on other forums is misleading at best. This can happen anytime a new product comes out.
Redcap was "Classic Coke"....Goldcap from the test results is "Classic Coke Extended"...just has more additives to last longer. There is a growing trend to change oil less frequently and Mobil needs to be a part of it.

From this test the only conclusion one can draw is that Goldcap is the same or better than Redcap...probably better and time will prove this I think.

Now V-Twin is 30% better than redcap in it's ability to hold up to heat and shear. The question is..do you need or want to spend the extra money for it? If you have a hopped up engine you should consider doing so ...if not it's just added insurance.

We now have a very comprehensive thread here entitled "Marine Lubrication". It pulled a million different lube threads into one...so let's try to use just that one.

I have learned recently that the overuse of additives can damage the oil's detergency. Goldcap turns out not to need any additives like other's once felt was needed. They are wrong about that and the test proves it.

Both Goldcap and V-Twin are available at Walmart.

It would be nice if oso might consider starting a lubrication "room" and moving the "Marine Lube" thread over as a way of launching it. Just a suggestion....we could call it the "Oil Pit"...anyone wanna PM OSO and ask ??

Fountaineer

Hydro,
what about mobil 1 10-30 for my Yukon?

Hydrocruiser

I saw where Mobil-1 5W-30 held it's viscosity and kept engine wear very low out to 18,000 miles. 10W-30 regular and extended are showing good virgin test results. I personally use a lot of 10W-30 M-1 in my cars. Good stuff.

mwdill

I have used amsoil 0w-30 in my f 150 for 95k, no problems, gas milege is still the same as the day i brought it home.

Hydrocruiser

It has a good TBN....uses a lot of calcium (4000+ ppm) and ZDDP is pretty high...no moly or boron...$9.00/qt

Great oil @ "0-W" for very cold areas otherwise the
Series 3000 5W-30 is considered by most as their very best oil for cars.

vandy021

You can also use Mobil 1 5w40 truck and SUV. Same as Delvac 1. I am using Mobil 1 0w30 racing right now in my 04 Caddy.

Hydrocruiser

http://theoildrop.server101.com/ubb/...;f=11;t=000310

6 month update of virgin oil samples.

All Mobil-1 products on here look real good.


10W-30 EP...ZDDP is fine here
5W-40 SUV...lots of ZDDP
15w-50 EP great ZDDP levels

I went through the entire list and you won't find an oil with more ZDDP than Mobil-1 V-Twin 20W-50...it's the "king of protection".

Also, 10W-40 Mobil-1 MX2T 4-cycle motorcycle synthetic oil rules in that viscosity as well as ZDDP king. Gotta be the toughest 10W-40 around.


..................................................

I noticed some Amsoil products to have moly in them...Amsoil had tons of anti-moly stuff on the web.. I wonder why the change of heart?

Hydrocruiser

Mobil-1 Delvac 15W-40

This would be a nice oil for a cruiser in moderate temps.

Definately lots of anti-wear additives...great offshore oil as well add to your list of considerations if you want a 40wt.


I was asked today what I would use. My reply was:

10W-40 Mobil-1 motorcycle oil in cool-cold weather; Delvac 15W-40 would be great for small blocks and cool to warm weather...then haul out the V-Twin for the 90 degree days of summer.

How about 15W-50 Goldcap?

It's great unless you are a fanatic like me who likes overkill.

Hydrocruiser

Bglz did an analysis...i am reposting this here so we keep the info in one place. Kendall GT-1 at 20 hours showed little wear.

So we know a car averaging 50mph with Mobil-1 (regular-not extended performance) 10W-30 can go 18,000 miles..hold it's TBN of 11 and have good additives to continue onward. That's 9,000 hours of oil service.

Now if you use the vehicle in towing a heavy trailer then figure you will need to change 2x as frequently so it falls to 4,500 hours or 9,000 miles.

Now if it were to be similiar to an offshore boat hauling continually you would have to drive the car at 100 mph pulling the trailer so lets figure then 4,550 mile drains or 2,250 hours on the oil.

Your samples came out great and I am not preaching to you to even so much as to consider to read this let alone change your use of GT-1.

It does suggest that we change our oil too soon when using synthetic oil and maybe 100 hours is more reasonable in stock non-hopped up/ non-blower boat engines.

Now your analysis showed a TBN of 7.2 which is good for a conventional oil. M-1 10W-30's is 11 and V-Twin's is 17. The main bearings run cooler with synthetic oils especially those with high TBN's. Sometimes bearing heat and stress does not immediately show wear in oil samples ...the bearings just seize at redline on one fine Sunday afternoon and the engine blows.

Synthetic oil has a greater film strength and protects better...not much can really measure this. We have heard major engine builders say they never saw main bearings look as good as they do with v-twin at teardown. That can not be refuted. It is what it is.

I guess synthetic oil is like faith..either you believe or you don't. I am not going to preach even though it's Sunday.

Your engine is in great shape...happy boating!

Hydrocruiser

From Blackstone:

JIM: The sodium in your oil is either coming from antifreeze or sea water, depending on how this
engine is cooled. In either case, it probably should not be there, but at least it doesn't appear to be
hurting anything. Most wear was lower than average, and the above-average copper is a result of
lingering wear-in at bronze parts. It should improve with time. The 1.0% fuel isn't a problem at this
level. The TBN read 7.2, still lots of active additive left. Check back in 20-30 hours. Hopefully sodium will drop.



509 Marine Engine NA

Oil Kendall GT1 20w50 Dino
Oil added 1 qt
Hours on oil 20
Hours on unit 200 approx
Date 7/20/2005

Aluminum 2 6 (Universal average is second number)
Chromium 1 2
Iron 17 22
Copper 53 39
Lead 6 186
Tin 1 2
Moly 67 31
Nickel 0 0
Manganese 0 4
Silver 0 0
Titanium 0 0
Potassium 2 1
Boron 11 40
Silicon 7 13
Sodium 56 16
Calcium 1941 1171
Magnesium 37 686
Phosphorous 851 791
Zinc 1016 928
Barium 0 1

SUS Vis@210C 77.4 82-95
Flashpoint F 365 385
Fuel 1% <2%
Antifreeze 0 0
Water 0 0
Insolubles 0.2 <.06

I'm very pleased with these results. Motor's wearing good, oil is holding up well. Excellent additive pack.

Jim




Originally Posted by bglz42
20 hours on my baby, period! End of story, ain't going longer...



The UOA's I just looked at on BITOG (motorcycle UOA section , they kill oil about like a boat...) shows MUCH lower TBN's than 11 & 17 (those must be virgin numbers, Hydro?).

M1 15w50 usually shows 8 or so TBN on reasonable OCI's, and V-Twin showed 9.6 TBN after 22k miles. OK, but not spectacular.

My TBN started out as 7.5, and only dropped to 7.2 after getting the crap beat out of it. FOR MY PURPOSES, this oil is working great for my engine. Just look at those lead and iron numbers...




Thanks!



Jim



Motorcycles kick out tons more heat and shear so the TBNs don't crossover to marine engine numbers. We need more UAo's.

You are doing the right thing...20 hours and out...you knew you had more but why risk it? $2.00/qt it werks and you like it...

I used to use the same stuff for 5 years back in the early 80's myself before going to Redcap and later to V-twin.

If you forget everything about V-twin just remember it is very high in ZDDP almost double that of most conventionals. Worth it just for that alone. Your oil is great but V-Twin will kick your bearing temps. down enough to get an average of 10* lower oil temps. on the gauge. That is a huge reduction in main bearing temps. I have heard stories of having to go to coolers twice the size to get that kind of heat reduction across the board.

We have not heard of any other oil used on oso so far that can reduce oil temps by 10 degrees but M-1 V-Twin...by simply doing an oil change you get tons of heat relief. That's protection.