Will stock 502 Mag injectors work with a whipple at 4lbs?
08-01-2006, 05:53 PM
#11
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Re: Will stock 502 Mag injectors work with a whipple at 4lbs?
Originally Posted by chase n us
I have twin 502's with the whipple side mount and intercooler. This set up is very tricky when it comes to tuning. I am at 5 lbs of boost and the Mefi computer was tuned by Tyler Crockett. We ran new Mercury injectors with no problems. We made close to 700 HP but richened it up so as to not stress the motors too much. We are now at 640 HP and that is plenty for me. Several times before we went to Tyler Crockett we did have problems as the computers were tuned too lean and the JE pistons had a melt down. The tuning was done by an individual who had some hack program, not the GM program and when I bought the boat in the middle of winter I was assured that these motors were in great shape even though I was very leery of super chargers, but hey I'm adventurous. I can say that the intercoolers definately need their own water supply as the water off the engine cooling will not be adequate, the Whipples are making some boost even at very low rpm's that is why there is no room for error. Too often people see an ad that you can slap this on or fit that on and it will work like magic. BULL!
This has been one hell of a learning experinece for me and I would like to thank the guy's at Hypercision in Tinley Park, IL. (Very Knowledgeable) Tyler Crockett, Jerry Stark and especially John Zapp at Zapp Racing for all of their patience.
This may sound like advertising but when you start from scratch as I decided to do I found these individuals and companies to be very trust worthy.
If anyone has any questions as to what I went through just ask. Hopefully I can save you the headach of spending the thousands of dollars on research and development like I did. By the way does any body have a need for a nice set of used once JE piston ashtray's? I have 32 of them.
This has been one hell of a learning experinece for me and I would like to thank the guy's at Hypercision in Tinley Park, IL. (Very Knowledgeable) Tyler Crockett, Jerry Stark and especially John Zapp at Zapp Racing for all of their patience.
This may sound like advertising but when you start from scratch as I decided to do I found these individuals and companies to be very trust worthy.
If anyone has any questions as to what I went through just ask. Hopefully I can save you the headach of spending the thousands of dollars on research and development like I did. By the way does any body have a need for a nice set of used once JE piston ashtray's? I have 32 of them.
Thats the same as I heard the side mount ones are very hard to make work
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08-02-2006, 11:22 AM
#12
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Re: Will stock 502 Mag injectors work with a whipple at 4lbs?
Originally Posted by Strip Poker 388
Thats the same as I heard the side mount ones are very hard to make work
08-02-2006, 12:15 PM
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Re: Will stock 502 Mag injectors work with a whipple at 4lbs?
I'm fixing to have to start tuning on mine. I see a number of things I will probably have to try to get it to idle properly.
Try opening secondary throttle blades. Drilling holes in throttle body blades. and if all else fails hooking up the computer and checking IAC counts and try something diffierent. If anyone else has any input on getting the engine to idle descent without the blower surge I would appreciate any input!! this is the first time I have tried it myself.
Thanks,
shawn
Try opening secondary throttle blades. Drilling holes in throttle body blades. and if all else fails hooking up the computer and checking IAC counts and try something diffierent. If anyone else has any input on getting the engine to idle descent without the blower surge I would appreciate any input!! this is the first time I have tried it myself.
Thanks,
shawn
08-02-2006, 12:25 PM
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Re: Will stock 502 Mag injectors work with a whipple at 4lbs?
While I had my motor on the Dyno at Tyler Crockett's we had a idle surge. He corrected it by doing something with the MAP.
The engine idles great now. Some installers remove the little cone shaped filter that screws into the IAC. That's a no no.
I do not have a piggy back computer or the additional injectors. We ran at 5400 RPM under full boost and the exhaust temps never went above 1,300 degrees. Ialso spoke with a representative at JE Pistons and was advised that their pistons are very happy operating at temperatures of 1,300-1,400 degrees. 1,475-1,500 it starts to get questionable. Above that say good-bye. The temperature has to be measured right at the exhaust pot in a header system to get the most accurate temperature as sometimes unburned fuel air mixtures ignite after this point and will give a erroneous reading.
The engine idles great now. Some installers remove the little cone shaped filter that screws into the IAC. That's a no no.
I do not have a piggy back computer or the additional injectors. We ran at 5400 RPM under full boost and the exhaust temps never went above 1,300 degrees. Ialso spoke with a representative at JE Pistons and was advised that their pistons are very happy operating at temperatures of 1,300-1,400 degrees. 1,475-1,500 it starts to get questionable. Above that say good-bye. The temperature has to be measured right at the exhaust pot in a header system to get the most accurate temperature as sometimes unburned fuel air mixtures ignite after this point and will give a erroneous reading.
Last edited by chase n us; 08-02-2006 at 12:44 PM.
08-02-2006, 12:32 PM
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Re: Will stock 502 Mag injectors work with a whipple at 4lbs?
You know guys, this is an install and place where a wide band O2 sensor in the exhaust and an accurate air/fuel meter is almost a must. On supercharged engines under boost the proper safe air/fuels are a must. as even with good forged pistons and such a "burn down-melt down" only takes a few seconds under high engine loads. If your going to spend thousands on these type of upgrades, spend the extra bucks for either dyno calibration from Tyler , Mark or such, or get a system on the motor in the boat and get the air /fuels correct right from the start. Your destruction rate will diminish and your wallets will stay fuller! I won't sell as many new piston sets but what the heck its still no fun for the boater! Just a thought.
Ray @ Raylar
Ray @ Raylar
08-02-2006, 12:38 PM
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Re: Will stock 502 Mag injectors work with a whipple at 4lbs?
My Stainless marine exhaust doesnt have a bung hole for the 02 sensor to go in. I would have to have one custom done.
I only have the piggy back computer and a vacuum line going to the main ECU from the original setup.
I only have the piggy back computer and a vacuum line going to the main ECU from the original setup.
08-02-2006, 12:42 PM
#17
Re: Will stock 502 Mag injectors work with a whipple at 4lbs?
Originally Posted by Raylar
You know guys, this is an install and place where a wide band O2 sensor in the exhaust and an accurate air/fuel meter is almost a must. On supercharged engines under boost the proper safe air/fuels are a must. as even with good forged pistons and such a "burn down-melt down" only takes a few seconds under high engine loads. If your going to spend thousands on these type of upgrades, spend the extra bucks for either dyno calibration from Tyler , Mark or such, or get a system on the motor in the boat and get the air /fuels correct right from the start. Your destruction rate will diminish and your wallets will stay fuller! I won't sell as many new piston sets but what the heck its still no fun for the boater! Just a thought.
Ray @ Raylar
Ray @ Raylar
I agree.Atleast on the dyno they can tune [map] it to be safe and then fine tune it in the water,Weld the bung in the tail pipe..I was fat after the dyno with the heat of the summer.I got Mark at Precision Marne to tweek on it and she better...Takes the guessing out of it and the dyno $ is nothing compared to a set of pistons,rings gaskets etc ..or even droping a valve ,Its just not worth it
Rob
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08-02-2006, 12:46 PM
#18
Re: Will stock 502 Mag injectors work with a whipple at 4lbs?
Originally Posted by noboat
That's why i was asking i had also heard of some tuning difficulties with the secondary injectors and piggyback computer. I have heard good things about the Arizona Speed and Marine package which included larger injectors and a reproggrammed computer instead of using the secondary injectors and the piggyback. I was just wondering if the stock injectors would be good at 4lbs.
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08-02-2006, 12:48 PM
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Re: Will stock 502 Mag injectors work with a whipple at 4lbs?
Ray,
What is your number at Raylar? P.S. I added a little to my last post in regards to exhaust temps and piston meltdown temps.
What is your number at Raylar? P.S. I added a little to my last post in regards to exhaust temps and piston meltdown temps.
08-02-2006, 12:52 PM
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Re: Will stock 502 Mag injectors work with a whipple at 4lbs?
From what I have found recently, correct me if I'm wrong but the latest F.A.S.T system is the way to go. Easier tuning if you are charged/injected. This was spoken very highly about by an reputable person by the name of "Keith"
