bcarpman

Stevexsm,

I think you're missing the point. It's not about where it's manufactured, it's about who's part it really is. If it's a knockoff, your chances of getting equivalent quality are pretty remote. No it really isn't that easy to punch a button here in the US and get the correct part from China, no matter how cheap you think (incorrectly) the good equipment and trained manpower to run it is. When an OEM automotive manufacturer has a part made overseas, many, many man hours and probably more than a couple of iterations go into making sure the part is right.

I'm guessing that when Edlebrock or Holley has something made overseas, they do the same. I doubt the clones do.

KAAMA

A friend of mine is a machine shop owner that builds machine equipment. His partner had to go overseas to China for a business trip a few months ago to tour some of China's machining production facilities. He was shocked at the massive pieces of machine equipment that China now has.

It's definately turning into a world market place that is for sure, but it might take a while for the U.S. consumer to gain confidence in overseas products that had a bad reputation for quality years ago. And when or if the consumer gets "burned" they become gun shy very quickly and the saga of "buy American" will continue.

satisfactionII

Knockoffs = genuine imitation wood-grain vinyl which = chit. I have no more to say about it.

birdog

A friend of mine has been testing China Honda small engine knock-offs for a couple years now. If you look at them you cant tell any diff at all.
He hooks them to a water pump and large fuel tank and runs them untill they fail. They seem to have the machining pretty close now {NOT at first}
But the quality of materials is not there..rubber seals failing,Aluminum junk.
castings..junk...Alot of things you cant see by looking.

stevesxm

all true enough, i guess. im just a dumb dinosaur engineer. i prefer to actually examine and actually test the products first before i condemn them... but thats just me.

as for thechnical savvy and might of the offshore mfg base, i think you are selling them sort...but again... thats your chice.

i prefer to believe that the laws of physics and metalurgy don't change just because you get past the border of the continental US. and in 25 years or so i had plenty of US made garbage pass thru my hands. some from the very mfgs you mention... anyone want to talk about the msd 6 boxes ?

SB

That's where a network of businesses / customers / others come in. For anybody in the HP industry, not to have a network like this is basically losing many, many times the data and real world experiences that you would get in your own small circle.

Laws of Physics get written after they are proven ans scientifically figured out. Many, many things that are being done in the HP industry have no basis off of current laws. Computers + their programs are not 'smart' enough yet. Trial and error at a dizzying but positive pace is beyonds laws. Yup, no schit ! That's why Mr Ching Lee (yes, made up name) at the plant and Mr Head of Sales Dude has a remote chance of coming out with new technology (heads, intake, camshafts) that makes more power unless they start school at an early age and go work directly and under the supervision of a current guru.

Some call it 'black magic' and in a way it is. A design can flow more air on the flowbench, flow more air on a compueter model, and make more power on a dyno, yet when it get's tested on the track, can actually be slower.

This is why involvement from the beginning all the way to the race track, is the only way your engine program will get stronger.

Many record setting engine builders + head/intake porters will be the first to tell you "If we made $$$ by flow figures and dyno tests alone, we'd be out of business and current records would be much slower (or etc) than they are today."

Undertanding laws of physics are needed. I agree !!! Without this you have way too much trial and error to succumb by yourself. However, this only gets you to a certain level and then you need to forge forward.

Go to a library and go look at SAE papers that prove/disprove many things. Look at the date of all these and you'll fall over.

Sea-Dated

Bottom line, if something looks to good to be true, it probably is and remember, you get what you pay for. If you pay $300 for a set of heads, that is what you get. A $300 set of heads. Also, even in our global economy it is still better to support American companies. But that is just me.

hunster

Seen it for ever in car eletronics. Someone decides to market a cheap made in china amplifier under the name "rockwood" similar to the high quality brand Rockford Fosgate. Another , "soundstorm" similar sound to the Soundstream brand. They make the merchandise appearance similar in shape and color enough to fool some people into thinking why am I paying $399 for this amp when the $150 amp looks just the same , Right? It's been out there forever , in everything , leather was the ticket 'til naugahide came out! The cows breath a bit easier now though.

JoeBro

Guys, my first post here. The thread caught my interest. I'm a relatively experienced Mechanical Engineer who has been to China and seen several machine shops there. Some have the best of equipment and some don't. As a design engineer, I model 3-D CAD parts for a consumer product company, and output programs to CNC equipment if needed. And yes as mentioned in the post, I can email those programs directly to China if so directed by my boss. If using Next Day Air, I can have parts back in less than two days. Depends upon complexity.

Do I feel this is wrong?...Yes I would rather see it made here in the US (although I do think there are too many folks asking for a handout now in the US, but that's another thread)

Do I feel I am selling myself out?,...Yes

What can I do about it?...don't know. I've got some ideas, but I've also got a family to take care of.

Just so you know, I can have an assembly of components that I designed made in China so that you will not be able to tell the difference. Guarantee it. That's how good they (China) are getting. Of course, without my direction to the China folks would be somewhat lost.

It's depressing I know, but I don't think anyone knows how to deal with the Global Economy thing.

Kidnova

Welcome JoBro.

Good points. Regardless of the country where a product is manufactured' combine good raw materials, good machinery, and good supervision, and the product will likely come out good. "good" can be substituted for, great, ok, fair, poor, whatever. So, a factory in China can produce a great product.

Still, knock off's (wherever their manufactured) you get for 1/2 the price of the "real deal" are not likely to be the best of the best.