Not as good as a modern Big Block Chevy unless supercharged
01-29-2003, 09:30 PM
#1
Guest
Posts: n/a
Not as good as a modern Big Block Chevy unless supercharged
The 426 style Hemi is no longer used for naturally aspirated racing because to get high compression out of em you have to use an extremely tall (heavy) piston with a huge dome. They can not use modern high lift camshafts either. I may be wrong but I believe that with high lift and long duration camshafts the valves will actually hit each other.
The 426 style Hemi is still excellent for a low compression supercharged engines because you then use a flat top (lightweight) piston. Supercharged engines don't require high valve lift camshafts either.
The modern big block Chevy (in naturally aspirated form, carb or EFI) will run away and hide from any naturally aspirated 426 style Hemi.
The technology of the 426 style Hemi is ancient, but Mopar is Pro Stock racing a new design Hemi (with two four barrels) that is doing well.
Even though they are old technology I would give my left testicle for a 1970 Cuda with a Hemi!
Two cents worth of knowledge from an old and loyal Mopar guy!
Sincerely
Dennis Moore
The 426 style Hemi is still excellent for a low compression supercharged engines because you then use a flat top (lightweight) piston. Supercharged engines don't require high valve lift camshafts either.
The modern big block Chevy (in naturally aspirated form, carb or EFI) will run away and hide from any naturally aspirated 426 style Hemi.
The technology of the 426 style Hemi is ancient, but Mopar is Pro Stock racing a new design Hemi (with two four barrels) that is doing well.
Even though they are old technology I would give my left testicle for a 1970 Cuda with a Hemi!
Two cents worth of knowledge from an old and loyal Mopar guy!
Sincerely
Dennis Moore
01-29-2003, 09:56 PM
#3
Platinum Member
Platinum Member
Dennis,
A buddy just bankrolled and witnessed the birth of a 530 inch Hemi of his dreams. He is like me and has built many motors on his own, but did not trust himself to properly do a Hemi with all of the "mystical tricks" to set one up properly. He had a older guy in Indiana set up the motor and used Indy aluminum heads and an Indy crossram.
I'm fairly sure I remember correctly that it is 13:1 CR. I do recall talking with friend about the dome size and such, but he said the dome is not the huge dome that kills the flame front and that his CR comes from it being a stroker.
All I know is that he runs race gas (sometimes he runs Nutec cut into it) and it dynoed with accessories (less PS pump) and full exhaust (4" flowmasters all the way out) at just a hair under 900 hp. Seen the sheets. 5800 rpm, to boot. I know he's happy.
BUT, if you want to talk about bang-for-the buck it's a different league altogether. His rocker setup cost over $4000.
It's in a street car. A PERFECT B-body Coronet with frame connectors and a Dana 60 w/MW axles. Mini-tubbed and running 13"ers. Not for race, just cause he wanted it.
Car has no practical application, especially racing. Has no traction - at all. Has never been opened up in the car, never for more than 3 seconds at a time. Can squeeze into the pedal at 80 and just meter out wheelspin on demand.
It's a sight to be sure, but only a Mopar faithful could understand the effort, money, and time time time time that has gone into this car.
I'll stick to Chevys...
A buddy just bankrolled and witnessed the birth of a 530 inch Hemi of his dreams. He is like me and has built many motors on his own, but did not trust himself to properly do a Hemi with all of the "mystical tricks" to set one up properly. He had a older guy in Indiana set up the motor and used Indy aluminum heads and an Indy crossram.
I'm fairly sure I remember correctly that it is 13:1 CR. I do recall talking with friend about the dome size and such, but he said the dome is not the huge dome that kills the flame front and that his CR comes from it being a stroker.
All I know is that he runs race gas (sometimes he runs Nutec cut into it) and it dynoed with accessories (less PS pump) and full exhaust (4" flowmasters all the way out) at just a hair under 900 hp. Seen the sheets. 5800 rpm, to boot. I know he's happy.
BUT, if you want to talk about bang-for-the buck it's a different league altogether. His rocker setup cost over $4000.
It's in a street car. A PERFECT B-body Coronet with frame connectors and a Dana 60 w/MW axles. Mini-tubbed and running 13"ers. Not for race, just cause he wanted it.
Car has no practical application, especially racing. Has no traction - at all. Has never been opened up in the car, never for more than 3 seconds at a time. Can squeeze into the pedal at 80 and just meter out wheelspin on demand.
It's a sight to be sure, but only a Mopar faithful could understand the effort, money, and time time time time that has gone into this car.
I'll stick to Chevys...
01-30-2003, 07:17 AM
#4
Registered
There's an interesting article of a newly designed hemi-type of engine in this months (January) Powerboat Magazine on page 46. A guy by the name of Tim Grose of Millennium Motors has been helping (with Joe Schubeck) develope a hot new dual overhead cam engine that looks promising in the offshore racing arena and hi-tech marine performance world. It appears that this engine will be going places soon! Fennville, Michigan is only 30 minutes south from where I live and only about 5 miles from the Skater factory in Douglas/Saugatuck, MI. I stopped by Tim's shop yesterday and knocked on his door. He invited me in and showed me a few of these engines. He had a black and white checkered flag tiled floor that was practically clean enough to eat off of.
Tim is a pleasent guy to talk to and is very professional. I told him that I certainly didn't have near deep enough pockets for his stuff, but he was still very humble towards me. He even took a phone call from a guy who was selling magnetic business cards while I was standing there, and was patient enough to listen to the guy's sales pitch, but politely told him that he wasn't interested. Tim was even kind enough to wish the guy the best in his sales before he hung up.
Tim seems to have a TON of outside interest in this new engine design and I believe he will do well with it. It will be interesting to follow his project.
Tim is a pleasent guy to talk to and is very professional. I told him that I certainly didn't have near deep enough pockets for his stuff, but he was still very humble towards me. He even took a phone call from a guy who was selling magnetic business cards while I was standing there, and was patient enough to listen to the guy's sales pitch, but politely told him that he wasn't interested. Tim was even kind enough to wish the guy the best in his sales before he hung up.
Tim seems to have a TON of outside interest in this new engine design and I believe he will do well with it. It will be interesting to follow his project.
Last edited by KAAMA; 01-30-2003 at 07:25 AM.
01-30-2003, 08:47 AM
#5
Gold Member
Gold Member
I saw one of those motors run in a fuel car years ago. If they get the packaging right it will be a tremendous boat motor. Nothing breathes like a Hemi with an iron lung!
01-30-2003, 10:32 AM
#7
Registered
Dennis
Would you consider the "New" Pro-stock engines an actual hemi considering they are just a DRCE combustion chamber turned sideways so the spark plug goes through the valve cover ?
How'd you make out with the bypass testing ?
Doug
Tech @ Barry Grant, Inc.
Would you consider the "New" Pro-stock engines an actual hemi considering they are just a DRCE combustion chamber turned sideways so the spark plug goes through the valve cover ?
How'd you make out with the bypass testing ?
Doug
Tech @ Barry Grant, Inc.
02-02-2003, 03:00 PM
#8
Guest
Posts: n/a
Right on RumRunner!!
I have also noticed over the years that if you start to outrun the hemis, they adjust the rules to "even the field"
In 1967 a friend had a hemi Road Runner and I had a 396 in a 55 Chevy. He blew me away. After so much mouth, I challenged him to race once a week for two months. We would chain our hoods down and give the other the key. I won. He finally had to "service" his engine and I did not. Hemis need a lot of TLC. They are great, but they do have drawbacks.
Notice also, NOONE is using the tru hemi head in anything anymore,
I have also noticed over the years that if you start to outrun the hemis, they adjust the rules to "even the field"
In 1967 a friend had a hemi Road Runner and I had a 396 in a 55 Chevy. He blew me away. After so much mouth, I challenged him to race once a week for two months. We would chain our hoods down and give the other the key. I won. He finally had to "service" his engine and I did not. Hemis need a lot of TLC. They are great, but they do have drawbacks.
Notice also, NOONE is using the tru hemi head in anything anymore,
02-06-2003, 05:57 AM
#10
Gold Member
Gold Member
Come one guys, when your the best gunfighter everyone wants to have a gun fight with you.
Blown 1500 Daytona 1969 1-2-3 nuff said, thats when NASCAR got out the pencil to "even the field". As far a a Hemi needing lots of TLC you are 100% correct, but most real, not street based, HIGH performance/race motors will need some maintaince to keep in a high state of tune, thats just the nature of the beast .
Formula- that coffee can full of rocks is a signature sound, trust me the guys who've been around the block a time or two know whats under my hood before I even open it. It's just part of the Hemi mistique. Ford, and Chevy guys alike respect the Hemi, it's just a neat motor, all brand loyalty aside.
Blown 1500 Daytona 1969 1-2-3 nuff said, thats when NASCAR got out the pencil to "even the field". As far a a Hemi needing lots of TLC you are 100% correct, but most real, not street based, HIGH performance/race motors will need some maintaince to keep in a high state of tune, thats just the nature of the beast .
Formula- that coffee can full of rocks is a signature sound, trust me the guys who've been around the block a time or two know whats under my hood before I even open it. It's just part of the Hemi mistique. Ford, and Chevy guys alike respect the Hemi, it's just a neat motor, all brand loyalty aside.
