solid, roller or hydraulic?
10-03-2003, 02:36 PM
#12
MarineKinetics
Platinum Member
Sean,
If you want the info right from the horses mouth you can call Harold Brookshire the former owner and designer of the Ultradyne profiles. He is currently doing a complete redesign of the Lunati line including an updated marine category. He is very helpful and will most likely help you find a solution to your problem.
He designed and made the 440 Magnum cam for Mercury Marine's 454, and the 700 BHP FI 482's roller cam. Also the original 502 cam. He can be reached at 1-901-365-0950 x135. I would suggest you get the grind and lifter part #s before you call him if at all possible. Feel free to email me if you need and further info.
Hope this helps,
Bob
If you want the info right from the horses mouth you can call Harold Brookshire the former owner and designer of the Ultradyne profiles. He is currently doing a complete redesign of the Lunati line including an updated marine category. He is very helpful and will most likely help you find a solution to your problem.
He designed and made the 440 Magnum cam for Mercury Marine's 454, and the 700 BHP FI 482's roller cam. Also the original 502 cam. He can be reached at 1-901-365-0950 x135. I would suggest you get the grind and lifter part #s before you call him if at all possible. Feel free to email me if you need and further info.
Hope this helps,
Bob
Last edited by rmbuilder; 10-03-2003 at 03:05 PM.
10-03-2003, 07:47 PM
#13
MarineKinetics
Platinum Member
Sean,
Solid rollers are probably not the correct solution in your application. They rely heavily on splash lubrication and can experience lack of proper oiling in no-wake zones or around the dock (under 2000 rpm operation). You wont be operating in an rpm range to really optimize the benefits. Add to that the additional maintenance and the best solution is to correct the existing problems with your hyd roller setup. Proper spring pressures and geometry are absolutely necessary in endurance applications. Try not to rely on generic spring pressure recommendations, find out the specific needs of your particular cam and make sure your springs are providing those specs.
If you are interested in researching this further here are some links to try. Hope this helps.
Bob
Rocker arm geometry
http://www.compcams.com/information/Products/Pushrods/
http://www.jimcookperformance.com/Te...olRocGeom.html
Spring pressures
http://www.rehermorrison.com/techTalk/03b.htm
Lifters
http://www.cranecams.com/instruction...in/camfail.htm
http://www.newcovenant.com/speedcraf...camshaft/5.htm
Solid rollers are probably not the correct solution in your application. They rely heavily on splash lubrication and can experience lack of proper oiling in no-wake zones or around the dock (under 2000 rpm operation). You wont be operating in an rpm range to really optimize the benefits. Add to that the additional maintenance and the best solution is to correct the existing problems with your hyd roller setup. Proper spring pressures and geometry are absolutely necessary in endurance applications. Try not to rely on generic spring pressure recommendations, find out the specific needs of your particular cam and make sure your springs are providing those specs.
If you are interested in researching this further here are some links to try. Hope this helps.
Bob
Rocker arm geometry
http://www.compcams.com/information/Products/Pushrods/
http://www.jimcookperformance.com/Te...olRocGeom.html
Spring pressures
http://www.rehermorrison.com/techTalk/03b.htm
Lifters
http://www.cranecams.com/instruction...in/camfail.htm
http://www.newcovenant.com/speedcraf...camshaft/5.htm
Last edited by rmbuilder; 10-03-2003 at 08:09 PM.
10-16-2003, 03:06 PM
#14
Registered
Thread Starter
Thanks to everyone who responded.
it seems the valvetrains really is the "brains" of the motor.
i never realized how important proper cam selection was or how many choices there are out there.
in the end, i left it up to the builder to work his magic...but mostly i wanted to be a little more informed and not just a guy with a wallet(although mine is quite small).
i'm told we're going to hydraulic roller cams which should do the trick. I'll find out more about lift and duration, but for now all i know is they were ordered from CompCams...any suggestions on part numbers?
should pushrods and valves be matched or do you just need to match the cams and lifters?
thanks again for all your help!
it seems the valvetrains really is the "brains" of the motor.
i never realized how important proper cam selection was or how many choices there are out there.
in the end, i left it up to the builder to work his magic...but mostly i wanted to be a little more informed and not just a guy with a wallet(although mine is quite small).
i'm told we're going to hydraulic roller cams which should do the trick. I'll find out more about lift and duration, but for now all i know is they were ordered from CompCams...any suggestions on part numbers?
should pushrods and valves be matched or do you just need to match the cams and lifters?
thanks again for all your help!
10-16-2003, 04:21 PM
#16
MarineKinetics
Platinum Member
Sean,
I would absolutely invest in the recommended valve springs for the cam profile you go with. It is quite probable that was the original problem you were encountering. Set the springs at the closed values rather than suggested installed height, if you have the opportunity check the open pressure also. Once your heads are set up on the motor determine your geometry with a pushrod length check and you'll have a very reliable valvetrain.
Hope this helps,
Bob
I would absolutely invest in the recommended valve springs for the cam profile you go with. It is quite probable that was the original problem you were encountering. Set the springs at the closed values rather than suggested installed height, if you have the opportunity check the open pressure also. Once your heads are set up on the motor determine your geometry with a pushrod length check and you'll have a very reliable valvetrain.
Hope this helps,
Bob
Last edited by rmbuilder; 10-16-2003 at 04:26 PM.
10-16-2003, 08:04 PM
#17
Guest
Posts: n/a
I suggest the Comp Cams XM284HR with 230/236 intake/exhaust duration, .547/.547 lift, 112 LSA, installed with the intake lobe centerline at 112 degrees (no cam advance). If you use the recommended lifters, valve springs and push rods it should last as long as any stock GM valve-train. Horsepower should peak at 5,000 rpm.
Dennis Moore
Dennis Moore
10-18-2003, 01:15 PM
#19
Registered
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Palm Coast, Fl.
Posts: 19
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Sean- Aftermarket Head Company's will roll the Valve angle to increase the flow of the head. If this is the case with your heads...then custom length pushrods are in order. This should be found while checking the geometry of the valve train as explain in Monty's post.
Ask lots of question from your engine builder. Remember it's your money! He should be more than willing to explain everything as long as your don't take up all of his time.
Good Luck!
Ask lots of question from your engine builder. Remember it's your money! He should be more than willing to explain everything as long as your don't take up all of his time.
Good Luck!
10-18-2003, 03:12 PM
#20
Guest
Posts: n/a
Duoprop Enticer
It would be ok but a slightly smaller camshaft with a 110 LSA would work just as well on a 454. The Comp Cams XR276HR, 224/230 int/ex, .510/.510 lift, 110 LSA, installed with no cam advance (110 Int. Lobe Cent.), would be perfect with no water reversion.
Dennis Moore
It would be ok but a slightly smaller camshaft with a 110 LSA would work just as well on a 454. The Comp Cams XR276HR, 224/230 int/ex, .510/.510 lift, 110 LSA, installed with no cam advance (110 Int. Lobe Cent.), would be perfect with no water reversion.
Dennis Moore
