Liberator21

The PIR device I used was not very high tech. I pulled it from a motion sensing wall switch like the kind you use in a walk-in closet. The electronics for the PIR worked on 12v, and the output when it sensed motion was a short duration pulse. More than enough to trigger any alarm system's positive sense input. As far as heat, or flapping canvas goes, I never had that problem. As a matter of fact, I use a portable PIR device stuck on the outside of my canvas to scare away seagulls! Gary, check out: http://www.radioshack.com/product.as...ct%5Fid=49-426 This is a portable pir device. I've modified things like this before to use the output to trigger an alarm system. The important thing to watch for is current draw. You don't want to kill your battery. All this is not very high tech, but it works for me.

rickcurtis

A PIR will work inside a cabin but not just any PIR. Low cost, low quality PIRs will react and provide false alarms from heat changes in the cabin, swinging curtains, and even VHF transmissions originating nearby. I use one that has been tested in a marine environment on my SeaRay. In three years it has never provided a false alarm. I got it from http://www.voicealarm.com for $99. I have the full VoiceAlarm system on my SeaRay and found that this motion sensor is great for protecting against someone breaking in via the overhead hatches, instead of having to do the wiring required for magnetic switches on each of my 3 overhead hatches.

Gary Anderson

Great, that should work! Wire it into my horn relay and it should keep the bad guys away. I've foud 110V AC ones but wanted one to wire to 12V system.
Gary

Andy Buzz

Read the specs on the PIR. You will find the effectiveness of a PIR is drastically reduced by heat in cabin past 100 degrees. If you are in a cool climate, this may not matter and work well. If you are in a hot climate, you would need a microwave type movement sensor. The security device that I offer has inputs that will accept PIR or microwave sensors. You can also add magnetic contacts and many other types of sensors.

Microwave sensors see thru fiberglass and can false if the boat is in the water moving near a dock. PIR is more stable. The best sensor are called Dual Technology where both body heat and motion must be present to trigger. The heat portion will still be hindered by high cabin temp but if the cabin is a small cabin, the hinderance may not matter as short range may be enough.

mcollinstn

Can't remember the brand, but theres a fairly new unit out there that provides remote notification and also provides alarm functionality (as a "second" priority).

The main unit is programmable via RS232 and software to set high and low alarm levels for a handfull of digital (on/off) AND analog (voltage, temp, etc) inputs. When an alarm state is detected, the unit will (via connection to an onboard cellular telephone) call a preset number and deliver one of many selectable messages over and over for a selectable time period (several minutes will ensure that even an answering machine will get the message in its entirety). I believe it will also call several numbers in sequence and deliver the message to them all.

Example: The cabin temperature drops below 40 degrees. A preset low cabin temp alarm state is triggered. The unit calls your home, office, and cellphone and delivers 3 minutes of a message that repeats "This is your boat, my cabin temperature has dropped below 40 degrees - repeat".

I believe you can also CALL the cellphone on the boat and if it is set to "auto answer", the unit will answer and repeat the status of each zone (normal, "near" high limit, "near" low limit).

The unit was primarily designed for boats left unattended in extremely cold or hot weather.

It can also utilize intrusion sensors and the full range of entry alarm trigger sensors.
Can also drive any type of alarm horn, etc..

I thought this was very cool. Can't remember the name or website.

The unit itself was around $3500. The cell interface was about another $700 (but you could probably cable one up for less). It came with no "sensors" but they offered several types of temp sensors, etc.

mc

Andy Buzz

For those that want notification, I offer a unit that for around $550 plus the alarm and sensors, will notify you via cellular if the alarm triggers or if the boat is moved. It will also provide gps location of boat. You or the police can follow stolen boat in real time or prevent the theft by getting there in time.

rickcurtis

[QUOTE=Andy Buzz] Yes, it is made in China; the source of the highest quality security products. Although the system that I have sucessfully installed in many boats and motorcycles, is designed in the United States, we must bear in mind that China produces electronics with the highest reliability records with superior quality control and consistency over the U.S. [QUOTE=Andy Buzz]

You must either be Chinese, or totally oblivious to fact.

As a purchasing agent for a large corporation I can enlighten you. When you purchase products from any Chinese producer you are surprised the first time you are invoiced and find a 8% to 15% additional discount above and beyond the negotiated price of the product. Then you learn that this is their "known failure rate" either DOA or within warranty. They don't want the junk back so they discount their known failure rate.

Directed Electronics (your car alarm equipment supplier), and you, know what the failure rate is. DEI buys the product from China and receives the discount for "known failure rate". Unfortunately, you and your customers have to suffer the inconveniences of the "known failure rate". Let's say, for example, that the failure rate on your Chinese car alarms is only 3%. That means that of your 47,000 customers about 1,410 have suffered the inconvenience of in-warranty failures. It seems to me that 1,410 dissatisfied customers is 1,410 too many. If you install Chinese car alarms on boats for use in a marine environment surely your failure rate and dissatisfied customer base is much higher.

Our company purchases electronic products from U.S. manufacturers who have demonstrated a zero percent failure rate.

It is an insult to the intelligence of the readers on this forum for you to say that Chinese quality is greater than that of U.S. manufactured products. Everyone on this forum has experience with Chinese products and knows better.

Andy Buzz

Not trying to be arguementative but you must be disillusioned if you think anything has a zero percent failure rate. It is fact that when it comes to mass produced electronics, the Chinese are second only to the Japanese. Maybe you could avoid making this personal by suggesting that I am Chinese as I am not. On the other hand, I am an expert in the security field and can tell you that I do have experience to judge products that work well.

You are suggesting a product that uses the same fender type key that was used in security alarms sold by Zayre under the label Universal in 1978. The optional one button remote is even water resistant. The fuseholder is not marine grade and I could go on and on.

I guess this post is not about security anyway. It is about the Chinese vs American security products and there defects according to your calculations that are rediculously calculated. It is fact that when large international orders are negotiated, that typically they provide overrun product. The purpose is to allow field disposal rather than having to return products thru customs and await shipping that could easily take six weeks each way.

Your calculator can only help you extrapolate the correct defect rate if you input the correct information. Personally, based on your answers, that are strictly grossly exagerated slams on the Chinese, I doubt you could assist a fellow boater with suggestions on marine security intelligently regardless of the origin of the product.

markt111

look into Flagship Marine Security, I rescently installed their system on my boat and am very pleased with it, I did not see ant ather company offer a similar product(deck sensors) once adjusted it works just as advertised and is 100% out of the way and invisable, came in a very neat litlle control panel and was easy to install

rickcurtis

I am not promoting any product. Only stating experience with boat alarm products that I have on my two personal boats. Both products are differrent, both are made in the U.S.A., and both have served me for a long time without any failures or false alarms.

Your constant self-backslapping about experience in security is very egotistical while based primarily on installing car alarms, in which field you do have more experience. Security in general and marine security, I doubt you come close to 20 years with the government in security, followed by 15 years, up to now, with the largest security provider in the Southern Hemisphere working in Colombia where there are real security issues and measures. I know more about security and marine security than you will ever learn in your life. Read up on MTSA and ISPS and you will learn how little you really know.

From many years of personal experience in dealing with Chinese manufacturers, including one which our company owns 50%, I also have more knowledge in Chinese quality and the Chinese mentality of low price. Do you know what the importer pays for one of your premier car alarms? I'll tell you.
About $11.00. If you doubt it I will put you in touch with the ex-Vice President of one of the larger car alarm distributor in the U.S. who will educate you on the known failure rate, economics of offering a "lifetime warranty" on a product sold for $250 that cost $11.00, and anything else that you deny knowing about your industry.

Your position and statements on this forum are designed to be self-serving in your sale of the only products you have which are made in China. If you had a product to offer that was made in the U.S.A. you would be on this same forum telling everyone about how your quality was better because it was made in the U.S. Your biggest mistake is hammering on the subject because the readers here understand you are trying to sell them the products you have available. By the way, I don't think this forum is to be used for commercialization of your products or services.

From a socio-economic standpoint, most of the forum users should agree that, aside from the known inferior quality, the fact that not one car alarm system is made in the U.S. (where years ago there were many), indicates the damage to the U.S. economy, and the tremendous loss of manufacturing jobs that has occured in the U.S. in recent years from the import of (principally) Chinese (Taiwanese) products.

Finally, anyone can readily see the quality of off-shore produced products by visiting Best Buy or Circuit City. See if you can find a Sony DVD player with more than 90 days of warranty. Anyone over 20 years of age has noticed that there isn't much quality in products anymore. It used to be that when you purchased a new TV you expected that it would last 10 to 20 years. Now when you buy a new TV you'd better buy the extended warranty.

So, Mr. Buzz, I only repeat the statement that caused you to climb on your sales soap box, "Car alarms are for cars and boat alarms are for boats". I think you should let this thread die because my next post will include a link to your Better Business Bureau file which will expose the "quality" and "service" complaints therein.