Question 2
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Just curious why do some former SV boats run P-2, and some run P-3??? I would assume they all have 525's in them, some run the bravo and few run the #6's, I have always been under the impression that they use top speed via a formula to place boats in classes where they should be. I ask this because I remember "Stickerboy" having to run P-2 in a 24 ft Skater, in sometimes some big water. and never thought that was where that boat belonged. So what is the placement rule???
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Just curious why do some former SV boats run P-2, and some run P-3??? I would assume they all have 525's in them, some run the bravo and few run the #6's, I have always been under the impression that they use top speed via a formula to place boats in classes where they should be. I ask this because I remember "Stickerboy" having to run P-2 in a 24 ft Skater, in sometimes some big water. and never thought that was where that boat belonged. So what is the placement rule???
A 24 Skater in class 2
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There really arent many older SV, so to speak as the class really started in 2002, When APBA had SV, SVL Twin then SVL
all canopy. In 2003 it turned SV with 525's and Bravo's. The thought being the #6 had too much parasitic drag to push a boat to the front, that is til Skater put them on, and made them work.
all canopy. In 2003 it turned SV with 525's and Bravo's. The thought being the #6 had too much parasitic drag to push a boat to the front, that is til Skater put them on, and made them work.
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yes a 24FT skater!!! in Class 2 racing against 38 cigs with twin 1000 hp. But to give credit where it is do he always finished the race no matter how snotty the water and has moved to a Spec class as he always dream he would, Ryan has racing in his blood.
Last edited by Pete B; 12-18-2007 at 11:52 AM.
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We had a steep learning curve running my 24' in the P class.....I was made to run in P2 with stock 200's and never give a chance to run P3 or 4. No biggie. We learned. I am very happy to be racing the stock class now in OSS where you know what you are up against. We will be racing with the OSS again this season with a couple of other races thrown in. Thanks for the kind words Pete you know we take pride in going out there and running and finishing races....no matter the conditions.
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The formula for placement in a particular Manufacturers Class per the 2007 SBI/APBA Technical Rules is:
Pitch X RPM X .01 divided by Gear Ratio divided by 12
To answer your question of older Super V boats running in P-3 or P-2, look at the following;
RPM.....Pitch...Ratio...SBI Calc Speed
5450......29......1.5.........87.8
5450......30......1.5.........90.8
5450......31......1.5.........93.9
5450......32......1.5.........96.9
5340......33......1.5.........97.9
5450......34......1.5.........102.9
5450......35......1.5.........106.0
A Mercury 525 EFI is limited to 5450 RPM. All of the older Super V boats running P-3 are running 29-31 pitch props. The older Super V boats running P-2 are running 32-34 pitch props. The ability of some boats to run the higher pitch prop probably has more to do with the model year of the 525 than anything. Older (2002-2004) 525’s have an average of 550 hp…newer models are running 565-580 hp. Better slip factors from hull design improvements on newer model boats are also a consideration.
The SBI/APBA speed calculation is based upon a 12% slip; obviously some boats have better slip numbers. The SBI/APBA Rules also allow the Inspectors to place a boat in a particular Class based upon their knowledge of the boat.
In P-Class the name of the game is acceleration. Look at the on-going discussion here on the Boards regarding P-6 and P-5 boats built specifically for the Class, the real crux is not horsepower…its acceleration…the ability to get to the maximum speed as quickly as possible without breaking out.
Most of the older Super V’s where originally Bravo equipped boats built for Super V when top speeds where 100-102. When the Super V speeds went up and they could no longer competitively compete with the #6 drive boats, they had no other place to race competitively except P-Class. Most tried racing in P-2, until it was realized that they would never be able to compete against blower motored boats with massive horsepower and acceleration. With a simple prop change, and drop in Class, these boats have the needed acceleration to compete against big horsepower blower boats and not exceed the maximum speed.
It’s just a matter finding a place where you can compete with a reasonable chance of success.
Currently, all the boats in P-3 are very evenly matched, some have better acceleration, and some can turn better, but in general on any given day, every boat in the Class no matter what engine/drive configuration is capable of winning the race.
The older Super V’s running in P-2 are aware that no one currently has built (or rigged) a boat for that Class with massive horsepower and acceleration. It is just a matter of time before somebody figures out what it will take…and build a better mouse trap. At that point I expect to see all the older (stock) Super V’s running in P-3
Pitch X RPM X .01 divided by Gear Ratio divided by 12
To answer your question of older Super V boats running in P-3 or P-2, look at the following;
RPM.....Pitch...Ratio...SBI Calc Speed
5450......29......1.5.........87.8
5450......30......1.5.........90.8
5450......31......1.5.........93.9
5450......32......1.5.........96.9
5340......33......1.5.........97.9
5450......34......1.5.........102.9
5450......35......1.5.........106.0
A Mercury 525 EFI is limited to 5450 RPM. All of the older Super V boats running P-3 are running 29-31 pitch props. The older Super V boats running P-2 are running 32-34 pitch props. The ability of some boats to run the higher pitch prop probably has more to do with the model year of the 525 than anything. Older (2002-2004) 525’s have an average of 550 hp…newer models are running 565-580 hp. Better slip factors from hull design improvements on newer model boats are also a consideration.
The SBI/APBA speed calculation is based upon a 12% slip; obviously some boats have better slip numbers. The SBI/APBA Rules also allow the Inspectors to place a boat in a particular Class based upon their knowledge of the boat.
In P-Class the name of the game is acceleration. Look at the on-going discussion here on the Boards regarding P-6 and P-5 boats built specifically for the Class, the real crux is not horsepower…its acceleration…the ability to get to the maximum speed as quickly as possible without breaking out.
Most of the older Super V’s where originally Bravo equipped boats built for Super V when top speeds where 100-102. When the Super V speeds went up and they could no longer competitively compete with the #6 drive boats, they had no other place to race competitively except P-Class. Most tried racing in P-2, until it was realized that they would never be able to compete against blower motored boats with massive horsepower and acceleration. With a simple prop change, and drop in Class, these boats have the needed acceleration to compete against big horsepower blower boats and not exceed the maximum speed.
It’s just a matter finding a place where you can compete with a reasonable chance of success.
Currently, all the boats in P-3 are very evenly matched, some have better acceleration, and some can turn better, but in general on any given day, every boat in the Class no matter what engine/drive configuration is capable of winning the race.
The older Super V’s running in P-2 are aware that no one currently has built (or rigged) a boat for that Class with massive horsepower and acceleration. It is just a matter of time before somebody figures out what it will take…and build a better mouse trap. At that point I expect to see all the older (stock) Super V’s running in P-3
Last edited by KenD; 12-18-2007 at 02:35 PM. Reason: align table
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OK I understand that, sort of. Obviously you would break out of your speed parameters if you used a 32 to 34 in prop.
What I am wondering is whats is stopping a boat from running say P-4, with a propped down boat...
Ken your boat was brand new in 2004 as I recall at the first Biloxi race, besides the new fountains, the old Spiderman Skater is going on 3 years old and yours 4. Has technology really moved that far forward, or is it the price point to buy a new hull?? that elimnates a update, besides #6's. how much would you figure to rig and re-rig a new hull.
What I am wondering is whats is stopping a boat from running say P-4, with a propped down boat...
Ken your boat was brand new in 2004 as I recall at the first Biloxi race, besides the new fountains, the old Spiderman Skater is going on 3 years old and yours 4. Has technology really moved that far forward, or is it the price point to buy a new hull?? that elimnates a update, besides #6's. how much would you figure to rig and re-rig a new hull.