Prop question - 340 Sport
07-19-2018, 01:44 PM
#21
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Well keep us posted on your continued analysis & findings.
Triple 350's can get a NT 340 on plane fairly easily & there is bow rise but it typically rolls over on plane rather quickly.
When you say say raise the engines an inch were your twin's mounted UP 1" on purpose knowing you planed to run B1's?
I ask b/c I tried to get them to mount mine a bit higher on the last boat and they claimed no gain and all that would occur was the engines barking much more in choppy conditions. NT may have simply been taking the more conservative approach or not wanted to fix what wasn't broke. Sometimes it takes someone like you or I to venture out and experiment. I'm pretty tight w/ boat building & racing veteran Ben Robertson and he swears the B1's would be better BUT his knowledge and experience generally surrounds perform,ance improvements found and made to Fountains. A Nor-Tech isn't a Fountain and Vise Versa.
Triple 350's can get a NT 340 on plane fairly easily & there is bow rise but it typically rolls over on plane rather quickly.
When you say say raise the engines an inch were your twin's mounted UP 1" on purpose knowing you planed to run B1's?
I ask b/c I tried to get them to mount mine a bit higher on the last boat and they claimed no gain and all that would occur was the engines barking much more in choppy conditions. NT may have simply been taking the more conservative approach or not wanted to fix what wasn't broke. Sometimes it takes someone like you or I to venture out and experiment. I'm pretty tight w/ boat building & racing veteran Ben Robertson and he swears the B1's would be better BUT his knowledge and experience generally surrounds perform,ance improvements found and made to Fountains. A Nor-Tech isn't a Fountain and Vise Versa.
My first guess was right where you are suggesting about twins. Let's face it, there are not that many twin implementations out there. But with higher HP available, there might be more in the future, especially in places like LOTO where there is much less need for trips since you are not offshore. I'm guessing the trip implementations don't have the same issues I was having with the Rev 4 set up, those issues being have to spin them 5K rpm to get out of the hole, and can't keep the boat on plane at slower speeds, especially on bad wash machine weekends.
Big Thunder did talk to Terry regarding the setup. I've texted Terry to let him know how well the B1s responded to the boat. 22P B1s is the smallest pitch they offer. Honestly, I'm not sure, (well maybe I am) the 300s would have a chance of turning those props. Most likely not. Since 300s were the highest HP offered when I got the boat, B1s probably couldn't be considered. I have not reported any findings to NT. But I have sent Randy Kent a note on how well the boat responded to the B1s. I invited him to go out for a few hours to test it, he responded he would like to. Makes sense for him since he is the market for twin 34s. I may contact Matt Lamb with the info. I'm not totally into top speed, although I don't seem to be giving any of it up. I'm getting better stern lift with the B1s. The boat seems to rise level onto plane versus go nose high and wait for the props to bite. It keeps the level attitude at slow speeds, and when running in the slop. Plus there is the surprising benefit of 20% better MPG. I did not expect that.
If the trip implementations don't have any of the issues I had with twins, not sure what benefits B1s would have. Although, it would be really interesting to take a triple 350 implementation, raise the engines an inch, and hang some B1s on it. The B1s bite, and carry the attitude on the twin implementation way better than the Revs do. Just as fyi, my neighbor just picked up a new 32 Sunsation CC with twin 350s....turning B1s! So it may be just a twin benefit. Does spark your curiosity though.
Big Thunder did talk to Terry regarding the setup. I've texted Terry to let him know how well the B1s responded to the boat. 22P B1s is the smallest pitch they offer. Honestly, I'm not sure, (well maybe I am) the 300s would have a chance of turning those props. Most likely not. Since 300s were the highest HP offered when I got the boat, B1s probably couldn't be considered. I have not reported any findings to NT. But I have sent Randy Kent a note on how well the boat responded to the B1s. I invited him to go out for a few hours to test it, he responded he would like to. Makes sense for him since he is the market for twin 34s. I may contact Matt Lamb with the info. I'm not totally into top speed, although I don't seem to be giving any of it up. I'm getting better stern lift with the B1s. The boat seems to rise level onto plane versus go nose high and wait for the props to bite. It keeps the level attitude at slow speeds, and when running in the slop. Plus there is the surprising benefit of 20% better MPG. I did not expect that.
If the trip implementations don't have any of the issues I had with twins, not sure what benefits B1s would have. Although, it would be really interesting to take a triple 350 implementation, raise the engines an inch, and hang some B1s on it. The B1s bite, and carry the attitude on the twin implementation way better than the Revs do. Just as fyi, my neighbor just picked up a new 32 Sunsation CC with twin 350s....turning B1s! So it may be just a twin benefit. Does spark your curiosity though.
07-19-2018, 02:35 PM
#22
Registered
Thread Starter
Well keep us posted on your continued analysis & findings.
Triple 350's can get a NT 340 on plane fairly easily & there is bow rise but it typically rolls over on plane rather quickly.
When you say say raise the engines an inch were your twin's mounted UP 1" on purpose knowing you planed to run B1's?
I ask b/c I tried to get them to mount mine a bit higher on the last boat and they claimed no gain and all that would occur was the engines barking much more in choppy conditions. NT may have simply been taking the more conservative approach or not wanted to fix what wasn't broke. Sometimes it takes someone like you or I to venture out and experiment. I'm pretty tight w/ boat building & racing veteran Ben Robertson and he swears the B1's would be better BUT his knowledge and experience generally surrounds perform,ance improvements found and made to Fountains. A Nor-Tech isn't a Fountain and Vise Versa.
Triple 350's can get a NT 340 on plane fairly easily & there is bow rise but it typically rolls over on plane rather quickly.
When you say say raise the engines an inch were your twin's mounted UP 1" on purpose knowing you planed to run B1's?
I ask b/c I tried to get them to mount mine a bit higher on the last boat and they claimed no gain and all that would occur was the engines barking much more in choppy conditions. NT may have simply been taking the more conservative approach or not wanted to fix what wasn't broke. Sometimes it takes someone like you or I to venture out and experiment. I'm pretty tight w/ boat building & racing veteran Ben Robertson and he swears the B1's would be better BUT his knowledge and experience generally surrounds perform,ance improvements found and made to Fountains. A Nor-Tech isn't a Fountain and Vise Versa.
I will continue to test as the engines break in. If needed this fall or winter I may get the props tweaked to pick up any remaining RPM. We were told FJ propeller is opening a shop by LOTO. That will be a nice convenience.
07-20-2018, 08:29 AM
#23
Registered
Amazing the difference the setup/props made. It doesn't feel like the same boat only with more power that now runs 8 MPH faster. It feels like a totally different hull. Jim Watson and crew at Big Thunder Marine did a great job on the re-power/setup. There is definitely more speed to be had once the mills are broken in and props are tweaked to get that last couple hundred RPM out of her.
03-27-2019, 09:32 AM
#24
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Thread Starter
Since it is finally warming up around these parts, I finally took the Bravo 1 props in to FJ propeller in Osage Beach. I must say, it's nice to have that reputable of a prop shop within a 10 minute drive. After talking through our experience last summer with the new 22P B1s, we decided to make some changes. The most obvious work that needs to be done is true up each blade and balance them. It was obvious looking at the props that one prop had more cup in it than the other, one prop had no cup in any blade. And the other didn't have consistent cup across all 4 blades. Pitch will checked and balanced between all blades, and we are going to thin the blades slightly to make sure they are all the same, and balanced. In order to carry the nose a little better at speed, we are going to cut off half the diffuser ring. I hesitated on that choice the most because I like the transom lift I get, especially at low speeds and getting on plane. But that comes with lack of carrying the bow properly at higher speeds. Casey at FJ felt by getting the cup right and getting more prop bite (I'm currently at 16% slip across the rpm range), losing half the diffuser ring would have minimal impact on the hole shot, and improve efficiency across the entire rpm range. But we will keep the 3/4 inch we cut off just in case we need it back!
Props should be done and back on in a week or so. Then I need to burn off about 150 gallons of fuel to see how they perform, as I filled the tank before winter
More to report after I get some hours on the re-worked props.
Nascat, the guys at FJ here are really big on the MAX 5s Merc came out with for OBs. Makes me wonder if NorTech has tried them at all yet. Maybe you should experiment! They are pricey enough that I decided to work the B1s as step 1, and depending on how this goes I may or may not get motivated to try a set of Max 5s.
Props should be done and back on in a week or so. Then I need to burn off about 150 gallons of fuel to see how they perform, as I filled the tank before winter
More to report after I get some hours on the re-worked props.Nascat, the guys at FJ here are really big on the MAX 5s Merc came out with for OBs. Makes me wonder if NorTech has tried them at all yet. Maybe you should experiment! They are pricey enough that I decided to work the B1s as step 1, and depending on how this goes I may or may not get motivated to try a set of Max 5s.
03-27-2019, 09:42 AM
#25
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Nascat, the guys at FJ here are really big on the MAX 5s Merc came out with for OBs. Makes me wonder if NorTech has tried them at all yet. Maybe you should experiment! They are pricey enough that I decided to work the B1s as step 1, and depending on how this goes I may or may not get motivated to try a set of Max 5s.
I'm definitely interested in your prop testing. Ben Robertson tried to get me to go w/ Bravo's on my 34's b/c he's had great success w/ them on the Fountain's back in the day BUT Terry & Trond insist that the NT hull does NOT like them.
I've inquired about SportMaster lowers & it was a No Go too.
My new boat and another were tested w/ the Max 5's, all I was told was that they didn't work & the Rev4's performed better. I'm not gonna lie that when I here NO to so many different tuning options that I begin to wonder if they just rather stick w/ what they know or stick w/ the proven but I really don't think thats the case. Nor-tech tends to constantly seek improvement w/ their products, whether that be design, options, fit & finish or performance.
Keep us posted!
03-27-2019, 10:00 AM
#26
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Thread Starter
It would have to have noticeable improvement to go from the Rev 4s to the Max 5s given the price difference. I will respectfully disagree with the guys at NorTech regarding the use of B1s on my particular set up. But that's neither here nor there, as most 34 builds are with triples. If we can in fact tweak the B1s to carry the nose better above 5k rpm, there will be no downside of the B1s over the Rev 4s.
03-27-2019, 10:07 AM
#27
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Understood and yes your application is different as would be the case w/ a Merc 400's or 7 Marine powered boat.
Shouldn't be 1 size fits all but typically up to the boat owner to experiment as you are.
Shouldn't be 1 size fits all but typically up to the boat owner to experiment as you are.
03-27-2019, 02:38 PM
#28
Registered
I can't believe how much Merc props blow straight out of the box. Redunkuless!!!
03-27-2019, 03:51 PM
#29
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Thread Starter
Haha. Yep, it was way off from spec. The ears on the 2 weren't even finished the same, but they were finished by 2 different people. One had the points from the casting still at the end of the ear. The other had the points rounded off. I'm wondering if we will find each ear is a slightly different pitch too. I will find out when I get them back. I'll know way more then. Then again, B1s are cheap compared to a lot of props out there.
04-12-2019, 03:43 PM
#30
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Thread Starter
FJ work done. Unfortunately due to Easter and a family obligation I won't be down to give these a spin until early May. But they look great!
